Are you an alienated parent who feels like chaos and drama just keep finding you—no matter how much you crave peace? Discover why this pattern might feel so familiar, and how understanding your own story is the first step toward breaking the cycle.

Main Areas of Focus:

• ​The addictive nature of drama and chaos for alienated parents​
• How childhood experiences and attachment styles shape adult relationship patterns​
• The psychological and physiological roots of seeking emotional intensity​
• Common behaviors and personas that perpetuate drama​
• Real-life examples of how drama manifests in daily life and relationships​
• The importance of self-awareness and responsibility in breaking the cycle​
• A preview that solutions and somatic exercises will be covered in the next episode

Notable Quotes:

• ​“Despite hating the distress, our brains can become wired to seek the intensity of strong emotional states, especially if those states are familiar from prolonged exposure to chaos or adversity in a past.”​
• “Crisis became your baseline. So your central nervous system registers peace as unfamiliar, and therefore peace itself feels like chaos for you.”​
• “If you are one that has noticed that you’re in this cycle of choosing the ‘wrong’ people always… it could be because you’re associating, on a nervous system level, love with chaos.”​
• “Trauma doesn’t just create your reality, it also distorts it. The nervous system may constantly scan for danger, drama, or chaos as a protective mechanism.”​
• “Drama may briefly feel like it solves loneliness or hopelessness. However, it brings temporary relief, followed by regret, shame, and deeper isolation, thus perpetuating the cycle.”

Key Takeaways for Alienated Parents:

• ​Drama and chaos can feel “normal” if you grew up in turbulent or emotionally neglectful environments; your nervous system may crave intensity, even if you consciously want peace.​
• Patterns of seeking or creating drama are often unconscious and rooted in early experiences—not a personal failing.​
• Common signs of drama addiction include feeling uncomfortable with calm, repeatedly sharing stories for validation, and turning minor issues into major crises.​
• Recognizing your own patterns—without blame—is the first step to change.
• Taking responsibility for your reactions, rather than focusing on others’ actions, empowers you to break the cycle.​
• The episode sets the stage for practical solutions and exercises, which will be shared in the next installment.

Next Episode Preview: Stay tuned for actionable solutions and somatic exercises to help you move from drama-creating tendencies to a life of peace—and actually enjoy it.

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 You are listening to the Beyond The High Road Podcast with Shelby Milford, episode number 158. Stay tuned.

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 Okay. Hey guys. , I put something at the end just now, I'm gonna just tell you real quick the best way that I can serve you, because this episode got so long is I think to split this into two. So I'm gonna go through the whole quote unquote problem, if you will, of creating drama and just present the case for you. And then next week, will be.

All of the solutions, your somatic exercises, all of, I can just give you the fuller picture with all of those as opposed to rushing and trying to condense it and put it into this episode and make it super long. So you're gonna hear the outline. I'm not gonna go in and edit it now, saying that we're covering it all in this episode, but just know solutions are in next week's episode.

Okay. And. I'm gonna get on with the episode. . Y'all have a lovely listen. Okay. Bye.



Hey, y'all, what's up? So I don't believe that there are any, um, new reviews today. I should probably go check. So , I'm gonna get right into it because I have done, I did such a deep dive on this and then I did all of this outlining. If you listen to last week's episode, you know how I was talking about fear and anxiety, and how that, while I was doing the research and doing the prep and the outline and stuff like that for it, I was feeling a significant amount of anxiety during it this week. So funny.

Um, we're gonna be talking today about being addicted to drama, chaos, you know? And it's really funny because I noticed that I ended up creating my own drama and chaos over the last two days during , the preparation of all of it, which I think is I somewhat hilarious, also somewhat disturbing because it, it did, it created some chaos and it's creating, um, some like extra work on my part anyway, or it did, I created that for myself.

So, um, I'll explain it in a little bit, once I give you guys the symptoms, provide the symptoms and stuff like that, like noticing how it might be happening for you, then you'll get where I was coming from. So we're gonna be talking about creating drama in your life or seeking it out unconsciously, subconsciously due to patterns that you've had probably since childhood.

Maybe in adulthood, like after, um, uh, one of the relationships that you were in. But I'm gonna say that for the most part, I, I believe my opinion that this happens earlier on, which is what creates the whole pattern of you choosing certain relationships in your life to begin with. Okay. I'm generalizing here, so know that if it's not you, that's fine too.

All right. So I did enough research and enough outlining to deliver probably three, maybe even four episodes on this topic alone. There's so much to actually cover. The more that I dug and then wrote out, and then I had more questions, and so then I wanna go do more research.

Anyway, there's just so much to cover on this topic because it, it's kind of. Central to our whole experience of alienation, right? Fear, like I was talking about last week, attachment, like this whole series that I've published the last what month or so starting with the attachment style.

So that was like four episodes ago. On through all of this is so central to our whole experience, like why this all was created back when we chose the person that would alienate our child from us and maybe even before, like I was saying. Um, and then how everything unfolds too. And then now that we're in pain, of course this all sort of intensifies our whole experience right?

And sort of, uh, shines a light on all of the areas that create pain for us, And drama. Inevitably creates pain for us. and here's the thing is that most of us as alienated parents, I mean, like I talk with you guys every day, many of you, you know, four or five of you a day, and is such a popular opinion, is that  I don't want any more drama in my life.

I want my life to be boring. No more drama. I'm over the chaos,  right? But then the more we get into talking, the more that we find out that the person who's feeling the drama in their life. Like pretty much all of us alienated parents are feeling it because of their own patterning, You know, the people that say,  drama just always seems to follow me. I don't know how, the narcissist always just end up in my life. I don't know what's going on. i, I always have the bad roommate, or things always bad luck always follows me  sort of thing.

But I don't really believe that that's true. And more and more research is kind of showing that it's not, you know. So we're gonna talk about why drama follows you, if that's you. why drama follows people in general and why it's so addictive. Feels so addictive if you already know that you're there, where it started from Where it likely started from. And then we're gonna talk, this is where I'm going to eliminate or put to the side. I have a whole section that I've done several sections actually on attachment styles and how those relate to and the different personas. I made up five different personas like how you might be creating drama through each persona.

And I'm gonna briefly go over them, but not in the depth that I was going to originally. Now if you would like extra episodes on this, I have all the material ready. So just let me know Hey Shelby, I'm interested in this. Want to hear more about this . so, but right now for this episode, so that it's not Three hours long. Um, I'm gonna go through what I just described here. I will briefly mention how attachment styles might have an impact on which they do the drama that you might be creating on your life. And then what that looks like.

Give you some examples. And then signs to watch for that might indicate that drama is an addiction or pattern in your life how you might perpetuate it as far as with your kids and what to do about it.

Okay. In a nutshell. So.

Let's talk about what drama diction is. All right. Despite what I wrote here is despite hating the distress, our brains can become wired to seek the intensity of strong emotional states, especially if those states are familiar from prolonged exposure to chaos or adversity in a past.

Well, you guys know that's all of us, right? Coming from alienation, but I'm talking about even further back than that, when the body is constantly in a state of survival, right? In survival mode, emotions like worry, anger or anticipation of conflict release, powerful neurochemicals, which we've talked about in the last few episodes, right?

Cortisol and adrenaline. That keeps someone feeling hyper alert and become as compelling as any other addiction. It's not only that part of it, I wrote that, but it's not only the cortisol and adrenaline portion of this little cycle that create the addiction, it's also the after effects, like the coming down effects that release dopamine.

Okay. Similar to how like, um, the cycle of abuse, like the stages of abuse sort of create that same effect where you're in the honeymoon phase. In the beginning I call them my Christmases, you know, where everything's great and, uh, they're courting you and, they're lovely and they, whatever it is for you.

Like for me, you could tell the look in his eyes, he would be like, all lovey and sweet. This is the last guy, not my, not my daughter's father. That was a different pattern altogether, but the last relationship is easier to describe. The other one was a little bit more covert. Where this one was such an easy way.

He was like, our relationship anyway, was the poster child, if you will, for abusive relationships. And so it would be that Christmasy time where everything, he was so attentive and lovey and sparkly eyes and you know, that, and he was just so considerate mindful and all the things. it was just so intoxicating for me, right?

Disarming and intoxicating. And then the tension would start to build, , I would start to feel like, when's the other shoe gonna drop? Sort of thing. And the more familiar I became with this cycle, the more tension that I would start to anticipate,

And then there's the big blow up, right? And sometimes that big blow up wasn't just one little incident, it was like. Days of blow up, just depending, and then there was the, I'm sorry, phase where it was like back to that honeymoon phase and then it kind of started all over.

Then there was this like an in-between phase and then back to the tension building and what have you. Right? So that cycle itself was super addicting to me. Addictive. I was addicted to it. And it makes sense why, because in my childhood it wasn't, as clear, of a cycle as that, but there was a lot of up and down roller coastering.

And so for you it may look like that. Over time. From childhood, you may start to unconsciously seek or even create situations with high emotional intensity, not because you want more pain at all, but because your nervous system has learned to expect and almost need or crave those acute states to feel alive or safe even.

That's what's so interesting is like you can, with your higher thinking brain, be like, I do not want that relationship again. If you've noticed that like throughout your life, you, always tend to, you want, and your brain, you want the healthy relationship, the purely attached relationship where they have boundaries and each person knows what's theirs and it's Harmonious, right? We all want that, but for whatever reason, it seems that, and when the relationships, each one of the relationships start, it seems like that's what it's gonna be like, , but then once you get into it, you realize that you're back into a very familiar role without even knowing when that all happened.

That's because your nervous system can already detect it way before you can, like, it goes back to the, the familiar roles you played without you even being, consciously aware of what's going on. So I'm gonna give you the three main reasons we do that.

So in childhood, the first two are childhood, um, derived. So in childhood you may have had a chaotic or traumatic experience, crisis became your baseline. So your central nervous system registers peace as unfamiliar, and therefore peace itself feels like chaos for you. So you would prefer to recreate, or your central nervous system would prefer to recreate. The actual chaos, because that feels calm to you. That could be one of the reasons, right?

Crisis became, the norm for body.

So what that might look like, and that's, it's different for everybody. I'm gonna give a few examples, but it's not limited to this, it doesn't always have to be, an overtly abusive situation that you came from. I wanna say that because I think that being addicted to chaos and drama or seeming like you're attracting it in your life doesn't always mean that you had some crazy dysfunction in your History, it could just mean that there was some up and down chaos.

It felt a little bit turbulent maybe, um, mom was away a lot or dad was away, or, uh, you moved a lot or there was some inconsistencies, , in, your daily life. So I moved a lot, a lot, a lot, as a kid. 'cause my dad was in the State department, that could have been one aspect for you.

You could have had a parent with a disorganized attachment style, you noticed that there were times where your, home field safe and times where it didn't feel safe and you couldn't predict it.

If a parent wasn't working all the time, like maybe the money was coming in sporadically, not necessarily consistently, or you had a brother or sister that was, or some other relative that was coming in and outta the house that maybe started trouble, started arguments was, combative and confrontational.

. And it also could be one of your parents too.. You could have had a sudden death of a parent that, caused this, or maybe it was an ongoing sickness too. Again, not necessarily always abuse, but that unpredictability of life, having your parent there and then all of a sudden parent is sick and not capable of, of helping you.

then gone. especially in your early developmental years, this could also cause , your central nervous system to be dysregulated as a younger kid. Any sort of threat, like especially ongoing and undetectable threat sometimes like where you're, you can't predict it, you're not sure when it's coming or going, is going to cause your central nervous system to be dysregulated, which later on in life is going to likely affect your ability To regulate your own self, but then also to choose, peaceful environments for yourself moving forward. You know? So chaotic childhood is though, number one, also emotionally neglectful environments where like, maybe you were the forgotten child or maybe, you had a a brother or sister who was problematic, , they were kind of the mess. And so , your parents spent most of their time focusing on that kid. Or maybe also on the other side end of the spectrum, somebody else in the family was the prize child. Like they were the ideal child and you were forgotten about



Either way. If your presence felt taken for granted,  but you realize that at some point that if you created chaos like you presented a problem to them, then that is what got you attention. Then in your mind from an early age, you realize that intensity, emotional intensity equals connection.

That became your currency to, for attention and love  and so this is actually, this is me for sure, is that my brother was the problem child

and I was more forgotten about. They just trusted that I would be fine. So in order for me to get attention, I either had to make things up and say that I also had the same problem my brother had, which I did on several occasions. Or I would create some other kind of, distraction for my parents so they would start to pay attention to me, maybe both.

Your parents worked a lot and so the only way that you could get attention was to like, break shit in your house or do something to, to grab their attention. That would create the idea of connection, right? That intensity and that upheaval made your parent finally see you, you felt seen then. That's what followed you through till maybe today,

and the last way that it can show up is that if you, for whatever reason, this is just more of a generic reason, is that if you. Create or feel drawn to drama because you don't feel comfortable, and I think it really still does stem back to one of these two things. But I'm just gonna put the blanket. If you feel like that creating some sort of drama or having drama, or that your body is drawn to it, not your brain in order to distract you from your own self or from the quiet and the boringness of your life.

Otherwise, like in your mind, external crises provide entertainment or a sense of peace and belonging, then that could explain why. Today in your life you notice that drama keeps following you. Okay? So you, in your mind, being alone with yourself and with your thoughts just feels way overwhelming and either boring or.

Like you wanna crawl outta your skin, then you might then wanna seek the drama from others. And that way too, when you do that, and this gets into maybe a later episode, if we do do another one of these, when you're seeking drama elsewhere, but not really creating it, um, you're just kind of like in the circle of drama, then it's a great way to feel like that you are a part of something without being the reason or like to blame for something.

So it feels more in control. And that actually goes into the one of the personas that I created that I'm gonna talk about in a couple minutes.

So if you are one that has noticed that you're in this cycle of choosing the wrong quote unquote wrong people always, why do you always end up with these abusive people or these people that would do something as horrible as alienation to you? It could be because you're associating on a, a nervous system level love with chaos,

that to you that, and I touched on this in the attachment episode of, you know, a few weeks back, that in order to feel the spark and to feel alive and to feel like there is that chemistry between you, that you have to have activation, and your nervous system then says,  this is familiar.

This is how we know that they love us, . And so your nervous system is like, yes, give us more of this. This creates all of the, the chemicals that we love so much and that we've learned to adapt to and need crave in our life. So you then think mentally, oh, this is love.

That's right. I remember this from when I was a kid. This is the feeling.  This is the, that burning in your belly. You know what I'm saying? That spark. But really fighting when you're fighting with somebody or you have that activation. The way that that is, it's really performative.

It's not connection at all. It's more of defensive surface behavior that does activate the nervous system and means nothing. It does not, no, there is no connection with love. Love on the other hand, feels, can feel pretty boring and not activating like that at all. Like at the most healthy relationships that you see, and maybe you're in one now and you compare that to how things were before.

Real love and the most healthy relationships, they do seem a bit boring. There is no up and down roller coastering because it's not built on reactive behaviors. It's built on mutual respect and, unconditional love for each other, boundaries and , respect. For, and of those boundaries for each of you



that is true connection. But if you've come from what I've just described here and even just from alienation itself, everything else can sort of pale in comparison to our central nervous system, you know, so, and on the other hand, so fighting is performative and more surface and is not love.

What is love is authenticity, authenticity itself is actual intimacy in connection. Like, so what I mean here is when if you feel like that you have to start a fight. This is such a common behavior with drama.

Addiction. If you feel like you have to start a fight in order to feel connected to somebody like, or to feel seen by them, because you're too scared to show who you really are and ask them for what you need emotionally. So instead you just start the fight to be like, you didn't do this.

Why didn't you do this? Because the fight feels real and feels like love because at some point you're hoping that they will come to you and be like, oh, I didn't. And then you go through that whole abuse cycle without even realizing you're doing it. I mean, I'm not calling you an abuser, but it's just that same cycle of like the buildup, the tension, the problem, the blow up, and then the connection at the end.

That's what we, many of us associate with love and connection. But that's not it at all. That's what is performative, instead, what is real lasting is when we can express what we need to somebody. Whether this is like a significant other or your closest friends and family, express what you need emotionally, internally, and not that they always need to provide it, but just being true and real with what you want in a relationship and what your quote unquote expectations are.

Putting those out there on the table. So there isn't any gameplay, there is no cause for drama. And then whatever they do with it is theirs. But that is opening the door to true intimacy, true connection, by laying it out on the line. Right. No games, no guesswork, no. 

Well, they should know, which is causing drama.  

just to sum that up, the circumstances around chronic trauma, especially in childhood, or through prolonged alienation, shape the subconscious mind's definition of what normal is, A person who grows up in turbulent circumstances or lives with chronic emotional threat will as an adult feel familiar in that level of intensity, even if it's uncomfortable or explicitly unwanted.

Trauma doesn't just create your reality, it also distorts it. The nervous system may constantly stand for danger, drama, or chaos as a protective mechanism, sometimes perpetuating or projecting it, making calm, or gentle peace, feel unfamiliar, boring, or even subtly threatening, which I think is fascinating.

That, and I see it with my clients often where there'll be peaceful moments, , periods of time in their situations, alienation, right, where nothing's really going on there's no conflicts, no emails are coming, the kids are texting or showing up at visits, doing everything's going great and parents maybe you can identify with.

This will be like,  what's going on?  They're like suspect of the fact that things are calm, that it feels threatening. And now I'm not saying there are times where the comb before the storm can happen, but for us, the drama addicts, if that's what you're gonna identify yourself as, we will, our central nervous system is so not comfortable in the boring or peaceful moments  that our minds will create the drama in order to feel safe again.

Like, I wonder what they're up to. And you going to the, I wonder what they're up to, creates a, like, familiarity inside you. And it feels better than the fear of the unknown,

there has to be something going on. So what is it? Basically you're creating problems  If this is you, I understand that maybe it's because of what's happened in the past, but then you're letting your past create your today in your future, which isn't really that helpful either.

But explaining that to your central nervous system, just like that isn't going to solve for it. So there's some steps that you need to take in order to get there. And I'll explain this in a little bit, but the point I'm trying to make here is that if you are addicted to, drama and chaos, or your central nervous system is anyway, during the quiet times, your body, you're not aware of it when you're doing this, but you will create the drama if there's none,

Okay. So here's a couple examples of that.

A parent says, I can't stand the drama. I just want peace. But then when their child doesn't respond to messages right away, like texts or whatever, then the parent sends several follow-up texts, first, gentle, then increasingly anxious or upset, like,  why are you ignoring me? I guess I don't matter anymore,  which can escalate emotion, and then making the child anxious and fueling conflict even though the parent's intent was for connection, not drama.

Now, you know that I also teach you that we can't make people feel certain ways. They're gonna feel however they feel based on their own thoughts about whatever's happening in front of them or even whatever you're doing or not doing. But because they're children too, and still, we are their parents, even if we're doing it from afar, um, we have a different responsibility than we would with, you know, the adults of the world,

so if your kid is under 18 yeah, I'll leave it at that. You get my point. Okay.

So the next one, example two I have is sharing stories for validation. So after claiming to dislike drama, an alienated parent recounts the latest family conflict again and again to friends, to support groups, social media, seeking understanding or sympathy. Now, when I say this, please know that I ha I feel compassionate and that I have empathy.

and I am not in any way singling you out or telling you that it's wrong to share with people and also on social media, I'm just saying that  for your experience, if you are saying that you don't want the drama and that you're over the drama, then each time that you retell.

Whatever sequence of events you're retelling, and if it's retraumatizing yourself each time you tell it, especially then you are like, when you're inviting the outside opinions and, finding yourself repeating, oh, this happened. Did you know, did you hear about when this happened with me?

And I can't believe that , they did . You know what I'm saying? , The gossip drama about your trauma. , Each retelling keeps the emotional charge alive  reinforcing the neural pathway that created it with the first telling of the story. 

Does that make sense? You're, you're reinforcing that, that whole thought system about the story and your belief about the story and how that affects you. For now and moving forward. Do you know what I'm saying? You're just reinforcing , the story in your mind to make that part of your ongoing story moving forward.

You know what I'm saying? You're practicing it. What is a belief? I've know that I've told you guys this before we talked about this, is that a belief? All a belief is, is a thought that you've thought so many times practiced that it's become native to you. It's become habit. That's what a belief is, no matter how it is.

Like you just practiced it either internally or externally saying the same sequence of of sentences, words put together. And now they become so ingrained in you that it's like a super highway in your head. And so if you're , continually sharing stories in order to receive validation or even listen, and I mean this with so much love.

So much love. I do think that there is a place for, and you guys, I know I've said this before, but a place for bringing awareness to the community for, to everybody about alienation. Absolutely. But the stories that if you're retelling them coming still from a traumatized state place, then those stories aren't gonna have, number one, the same impact as they would ha had you walked through it and gotten to the healed place, talking about it in the past tense, where it's not affecting you anymore.

You know, that's one, but two, those stories. So the impact is gonna lessen by you just telling them everything in real time. But it will get clicks and it will get likes and it will get engagement if you're doing it on social media. But two, it's going to keep you in that trauma. It's gonna be harder for you to heal because of how practiced your, those stories are for you, if that's a, a pattern for you. 

Especially, 'cause if you're telling yourself that you don't want any more drama in your life,  you know, example three inviting helpers into the conflict.. It's like you just want everything to settle down, is what you might say.

But then feeling desperate after some sort of painful interaction. , Like something went down and your kid didn't come to you or they didn't call you and they said they were going to, you might ask other people to get involved or just tell them because you're feeling the pain of not having them, like not being received by them the way that you wanted to be received.

So you tell other people with , oh, how do I say this with the intention? Maybe it's not even like a conscious intention, but somewhere in you emotional brain's intention is to have them advocate for you in some way. Or maybe it's just to also, it's just to seek validation.

But either way, you invite other people into the conflict or into the invalidating situation that you felt you were in. By doing that, it multiplies the voices. It multiplies the perspectives, and if the people that you might be telling this to  you are gonna tell the people that you know will agree with you,

that will. Back you up in the way that you're feeling because that's just how our minds work. That's how we are. We wanna tell people that aren't gonna oppose and, challenge us in that situation, especially when we're already feeling invalidated. We're gonna find people that wanna back us up and cause us to feel more supported. 

But by doing that, you're intensifying the conflict even inside you because now you have all these other people that believe and feel for you too. So that ingrains the negativity and the drama in your own, take on it, so you've employed, recruited all these people. This not, I'm not saying like flying monkeys, but recruited all this support,  but they are supporting the retraumatization of you. 

You know what I'm saying? Alright. Example four. Responding to calm was suspicion. Like I was just kind of touched on there. When things are finally quiet, the parent feels restless or anxious, wondering is something wrong? This leads to probing questions or subtle digs about the other parents.

Sometimes, not always, not always the other parent, but like, I bet Dad told you not to call. I bet mom told you not to call. Oh, they don't like it when you call, so I get it. So you don't, you know, when you say like, there's just a little drop of something to let them know that, you know, during moments that could have been peaceful.

stirring tension out of a need to resolve your own discomfort with calm. So it's all done on such a, there's one more example, but it's all done on such an unconscious, subconscious level that oftentimes you don't even realize if this is you, that you're doing it.

You know, the last example here is that you're turning schedules into power struggles. Sometimes this is done more internally than it is. , Like you, you may not voice this, but maybe a power struggle in your head. Like where you, you, you tell yourself, God, I hate fighting over the schedules. And then you insist on like, changing the pickup time or like a last minute debate, or like, you get upset even though you hate fighting over schedules.

You are the one that gets upset about every holiday detail, or them not bringing them back on time, if you're doing it outwardly, it's gonna force more negotiation and irritation without even realizing these actions repeatedly generate conflict.

You could do it on the inside and then take the victim mindset. This always happens. They never bring them home. I'm not saying that this isn't completely real and it's not frustrating and all the things, but if you wanna step away from the drama, then you gotta pick your battles and manage your mind in the moment, you know?

And like, what am I going to bring my focus to right now? Is this worth it for me? And the only time I will say that it's worth it is if you have a plan of action to make it worth your while. , To fix whatever is going on with scheduling. Like if you are planning to one, I mean, the. Most radical or like the biggest move you could make is like, go to your attorney or do something about it, like in the courts.

That's fine. You can do that if you want, and that's a solution, right? If you're doing it because you really just wanna put an end to all of this, that may be the solution. But there could be other ways, other avenues that you could take to solve for any misunderstanding with schedules or whatever might be coming up for you as far as your protocol for how you approach the next holiday schedule or the next exchange or whatever it is. You can follow your own protocol to eliminate or lessen the chances of any sort of misunderstanding or, you know, snafu. So that's when I think it would be worth it but otherwise, if you're saying that you don't want drama and then you find yourself going right back in, you're telling yourself, well, they're not giving me a choice.

They're creating the drama. But if you've already said that you hate fighting over schedules, then stick to that. You don't need to fight over the schedules if you don't want to, if it's not worth it or if you don't think it's gonna get anywhere anyway. You know, it's like a way, I guess what I'm getting at here is that sometimes it's just a way, like I was saying in the beginning, to keep your mind occupied because you're so used to that state to find what's wrong with the picture.

 And when it comes to alienation, we don't have to look far, you know? Which probably is not the best thing to say out loud to you because that only adds to the drama causing statements. I probably won't edit it out though, 'cause it's real, but it's true. I mean. It you for sure. If you wanna go and look and find all the ways that they are creating the drama and you're just witnessing it, sure.

I mean, we could all find that, right? But the most important thing here is what is your experience then by you finding all the ways that they're creating drama. You're the one that feels the drama.  I'm not saying like, just turn away and pretend like it's not happening. Sit in denial. But I guess it's just all about your experience and what you're choosing to see what lens you're looking through to see it.

So here's some signs to watch for that might indicate drama addiction. Life is often filled with conflict, chaos. Or emotional ups and downs and calm and peaceful times feel unfamiliar or even uncomfortable.

Basically what we've been talking about, you have a tendency to share dramatic stories on social media also, I mentioned that above, with others, , repeatedly seeking attention or validation from the reactions of others. Relationships with family partners, colleagues feel turbulent with frequent arguments, breakups, or cycles of emotional highs and lows.

When one drama ends, a new one seems to start. There's a pattern of amplifying small issues into major crises. Like making mountains outta molehills, seeing something like are your responses, which isn't necessarily always gonna be an easy one to answer. You really have to, if your.

Looking at these while I'm reading them out, if you can just, I'm gonna offer that you would take a deep breath and come from like a humble place and want to see this in you so that you can upgrade your experience moving forward. None of what I'm saying as usual.

And if you've been listening to me for a while, you probably know what I'm getting ready to say. None of this is to blame you. We're not, I'm, this is not about fault finding here. It's about evolving your experience of alienation and of all your relationships moving forward so that you can move to a more securely attached style, and behaviors that promote a sense of connection, also advocating for your own independence and sense of agency and harmony, moving forward, helping you to like, be able to recognize that we're all, all of us, even if we're talking about the alienator, we're all human.

And it's not, it doesn't though they are practicing right, wrong, bad, good, yada, yada, yada. They can do that and that's fine. But you, their experience of you and their experience in general, their take does not have to be yours. You don't have to jump on board with them, you know, and by not jumping on board with them, your experience will be that much better.

Okay? So it's not about point. All right? There's habitual blaming of others for problems. Okay. Rarely taking responsibility for your own part in the conflict. Okay, so this can show up. Like for me for long period of time, I was like,  they're the problem.

They're always the problem.  I was never able to look at my own missteps or whatever because , in my mind, their actions were so egregious and so radical and big that mine seemed like nothing. And I wouldn't have reacted that way if it wasn't for them. But I'm still putting all of my focus on that and not even looking at my responses, which again, will keep you in that special kind of hell, because then you're always waiting for them to change in order for you to feel good.

 That's what drama seeking is in a nutshell. It. If you are a seeking drama or your body is seeking drama, it's really you wanting somebody else, or whoever, maybe it's groups of people to change so that you can feel better. And doing so will keep you in sort of a victim mindset and you, it'll keep you at a standstill because you can't do anything until they change, you know?

And you know that's never gonna work for you. And it will continue to cause drama in your own life because you're always focused on them and , who's doing wrong? You know, feeling bored, restless, or anxious when things are too quiet. Subconsciously seeking ways to serve things up or to return to excitement.

You don't do this consciously. Okay? Just notice, like if you go look back on your life and the relationships that you've been in up until now. Notice where like the upheaval was. is there a pattern there? do all the relationships? Like did your role seem somewhat the same or was there a lot of drama?

Do you always attract the person that creates the drama in your life? You know, if that's the case, then maybe it's not necessarily always them that's creating the drama, but you seeking out that. And it could be the combination of like y'all together, like dynamics, anyway, noticeable, difficulty relaxing, and inner tension or agitation when things feel normal or stable.

manipulating situations or people often unconsciously to provoke a reaction, maintain control or avoid deeper emotional discomfort. Okay, so you avoidance out there, this could be you, like this is a, very typical. Avoidant or maybe even anxious avoidant, like disorganized attachment style. Habit is to seek people that in order to maintain a sense of control,

or, , power. And this is me, I did this sometimes too 'cause I'm kind of a mix of the two or I used to be, I used to want to find people that in some way I, again, not on the forefront of my mind, but in some way I felt superior to, or I could feel superior to because that way in arguments or in a pinch, then I could always feel like the good one in the relationship.

Do you know what I'm saying? As a way to also kind of keep me out of having to become vulnerable. So if that's you, and if you notice that you're always, what's coming to mind right now, and this was not my experience, this was not me, but what's coming to mind right now is, you know, sometimes like you see the movies where like , I hate to say this 'cause it sounds so shallow, but like the popular person will hang out with the unpopular people just to feel superior.

They do that as a way of separating themselves and keeping a wall up because if they were, partnered up with friends or, or significant others that they felt equal to then at, they would feel like that there was a, , a threat of becoming lower than them. And so it's just a way to keep people at arms length.

Hopefully. That makes sense. And with anxious attachment. Let me just go there, let me pull up my other notes. 'cause I have like pages and pages of them. So I'm gonna actually, I'm gonna give you, right now, I'm gonna give you the five personas that each of the insecure attachment styles can fit into. This is all the drama seeking behaviors. Okay, so the fire starter is your conflict seeker, in the anxious attachment style is starting the fights in order to. Create a situation of closeness, right? Because when anxious person creates the fights, the ideas, just like in childhood, that if I can start the fight, then I'll get the attention,

that was the way to divert parents' attention from whatever else they were, engulfed in, And then all of a sudden the kid got the attention That was their currency for love. For, avoidant attachment style, if they're the fire startup, they used the fight in order to create distance and go do what they wanna do and not have to connect and not be vulnerable.

and I'm sure all of you guys can identify either yourself or a former partner, whoever in either of those. So, Avoidance will start fights in order to create space. Anxious will start fights in order to bring somebody closer to them. Okay. The perpetual martyr, which is like the victim persona that I actually talked about recently and probably all of all of them, and an anxious attachment style, they frequently express how hurt, rejected, or unappreciated they feel seeking attention, rescue or validation.

the avoidant attachment style.

They dismiss others' emotions while elevating their own. So they minimize other people's feelings to say, look how bad I have it. Does that make sense? Like, oh, whatever with you. I have it way worse, right? I'm the special snowflake. You guys don't know what I'm talking about,

so you put people away from you that way.. The intensity junkie, like the excitement seeker anxiously attached parents will invite emotional drama, rollercoaster relationships, or passionate makeups after intense fights, which I was just referencing earlier. Um, equating volatility with true love connection.

Where the avoidantly attached, will sabotage intimacy when things get too calm. Right? So they'll, it's kind of the same with this one.

Anyway, the Fire Starter and Intensity Junkie kind of. Looks the same. they just start shit to sabotage and push away, okay. So the next is the savior trap, or like the rescuer, which is what my mom was. She, so just a side note, she was disorganized.

Attachment style, I think anywhere is a disorganized attachment style. And she needed somebody to fix in her life in order to feel needed herself, to feel important. The way that that shows up in an anxious style is they jump to solve other people's problems, Compulsively needing to be indispensable as a way to guarantee attachment. . They sacrifice their own needs, but later express resentment or disappointment, if not recognized, amplifying relational tension, right? So they really want, it's the, the, the people pleasers, right? They wanna go and do all this stuff and be seen as this, the rescuer, 

um, and when I say that, and you know, I said this before, but I wanna say it again in case you didn't hear the other, these are just states of mind that we get into our behaviors that become, we've sort of adopted as our own. I'm not saying that this is who you are, like that you are one of these and you have to fit into one of these categories.

It's just tools and behaviors that you've developed over time because that's what's worked for you or felt the most comfortable based on your childhood and all the relationships up until now. Okay. It doesn't mean that you have to stay in this and this is yours forever. This is, I don't believe that your identity ever needs to stay the same.

I think that we're constantly evolving that without even, sometimes without even knowing it. But the more that we are aware of the styles and we can identify with what sort of fits for us in the moment, the more than we're that we're able to do something about it. If that's what we wanna do, if the results that we're creating in today aren't working for us. 

Okay. Alright. So the savior trap, for the avoidant, what this looks like is choosing safe relationships. I just mentioned this as a way to maintain control, right. Seeking partners or friends perceived as less competent to feel capable and in command positioning themselves as the fixer or the superior as they're looking for the project relationship.

They want somebody that they can build up and fix up, right? And then let them go many times, you know? Hmm. But what that supports for them as the avoidant is keeping people at arm's length, right? Because they're not at the same level in the avoidance mind. Oh, I'm just fixing them. They have a long way to go, right?

And so they, it's a way for them to, um, feel important. Okay. I shouldn't say them. I should say us, since I do still have some avoidant tendencies. Okay. And then the last one, I think I've done four, is the story spinner, right? The drama creator, shit starter. So for the anxious person, they share dramatic stories about relational chaos in order to gain sympathy, to control the narrative or disperse emotional overload.

They're the ones that wanna tell you, dump it all right. Um, we are the ones, I don't know how you want me to say that. You know what I mean? I'm not trying to point fingers. You often tell conflicting versions of events to different people generating confusion in intensifying group drama. Like you could get caught in little fibs, you know, because you tell it one way to somebody and you tell it another way to somebody else.

It's, that does not have to be like, it's not exclusively, uh, a behavior of only this type. So just know that. Anyway, these are all not set in stone. Okay? So the story spinner or the drama person shit starter for, the avoidant type, they use humor or sarcasm as a shield,

and so they diffuse and deflect vulnerability with what stirs controversy or tension. Look what they're doing. But look over there. They're doing the same thing or you are doing the same thing, yada, yada, yada, yada. They like will spill someone else's tea in order to divert attention. Right.

And take the heat off of them a lot of times. That's one of the examples. I'm sure there's so many. , Creating unattainable standards, setting expectations that invite failure, criticism, and gossip of other shortcomings generating ongoing drama through storytelling about relational disappointments.

Right. Can you believe what they did? Can you believe their attitude? I mean, I just, especially when gossiping, , this is like the quintessential, or like the typical. Drama starter, and I'm, right now I'm picturing like back in the fifties, drama, starting with the housewives.

You know, like in the little boxes on the street, like five houses and all the moms or wives would go together to one person's house. I don't know what movie I saw this in or where I've seen it, but it just seems so typical. And there's one like Leader of the Pack that's like, did you hear what Susie did?

You know? But it's a way to stay and create this drama that feels so juicy and feels like you're aligning yourself with others. Right? And you're also bringing yourself up so that other people are down and it's creating drama,  So those are the, all the ways that it can come out. Listen, this was definitely not exhaustive by any means. There's so much more that I could, we could talk about, but I wanna bring it back now because I just went through all of those, which were kind of basic and not so much about alienation, like the five personality types.



So I'm gonna, go through how parents like us might perpetuate the drama and it will actually, on the psychological perspective, sort of do an overview of what we've just sort of gone over. But from a psychological perspective, seeking validation and attention, you, an alienated parent might repeatedly share struggle on social media , seeking validation or sympathy from friends in online communities, which can keep the family conflict public and ongoing.

I know that many of you are inclined to stay very quiet and not talk about it at all.

But maybe that shows up more on an internal level where you're creating drama inside of you by the stories that you're repeating to yourself and like in your small circle. Perpetuating that drama or keeping the drama of the old stories alive is going to keep you stuck in feeling all that drama no matter who you're sharing it with.

If you're sharing it with one person or 200 people.

You may instigate arguments with your significant other or friends due to feeling rejected by your kids. And then project that onto your partner. That's usually an anxious mile. It could be avoidant too both can do that. , And disorganized obviously as well.

, Like the instigating arguments. Is such a common thing to do. Um, in fact, one of my clients She just was recently going through that where her kiddos would specifically, one kiddo would not call or.

Respond to her text and she was feeling rejected. And then she would go and project that onto her partner, which he is avoidantly attached , and she's anxiously attached. And so those two are like oil and water anyway. So the more that she would reach out to fight with him in order to draw him in, the more that he would avoid her and push her away.

And so she was constantly feeling very frustrated with all of it because her tools and tactics weren't working on him, and he was not getting what he wanted. And it was a big mess though. Those two can, , like perpetuate that cycle for a long period of time.

Like I shared with you, you know, I was with, uh, an avoidant and, and, and he brought out the anxious in me. In fact, an avoidant partner will bring out so much more anxious in whoever they're dating really, if they're kind of like a mix between, and that itself will create so much drama. And you're telling yourself you don't want drama.

I don't want drama. I want drama. But the people that you're choosing in your life are just perpetuating that whole cycle of it. So really look at patterns you have. If you're not married, if you're with somebody that you're, you know, just dating or whatever.  I mean, even if you are married, I would say I look at that too.

 because your significant other, the relationship that you have with them will affect your relationship with your kiddo and vice versa. It really, all of your close relationships will sort of overlap and least in the way that you approach them. Because of how you're feeling. So if you want to minimize the drama, really look at the patterns that you have in them and see where you might be, creating the overlap yourself.

Like if you're feeling rejected by your kiddo, and then maybe you're projecting that onto your partner and  needing them to not reject you, and so you're really leaning on them. That's gonna create friction there.  And maybe even , if they're avoidant, lots of space there, which will cause you to doubly feel rejected,  which is huge, you guys, to really notice that in your relationships because it will, it'll cause further not only drama and chaos inside of you, but in your life and reinjure the wounds that you're already feeling from your kiddo kiddos,

It's unnecessary drama that you're creating by the person that you've chosen to be in relationship with.

I'm not trying to create upheaval in all your relationships, but really it might help you to take a good look at the patterns that you currently have in your relationships. Because if that is the case, like you are either anxious or avoidant and that you have the opposite kind of partner, it might be compounding your issues and your, the effects of alienation because of the patterns that you have with them.

And in my eyes, I believe like there are no mistakes and that there's always something that you can learn and evolve through as a result of picking those partners in the first place. It doesn't mean that you're duped, like, oh my God, I picked a the wrong partner.

Again, it doesn't have to be like that. You could just decide like, this is here for me so that I could feel this pain and move from it and start becoming more securely attached in all of my relationships moving forward. Right? It doesn't have to be a reason like for calamity, because if you are a drama seeker, the chances are that you will find it as, you know, another way to kick create a cast.

Oh my gosh, I've chosen all the wrong partners my whole life. Fuck, what do I do? You know, it doesn't have to be like that. It's like just a learning experience. All right. From a survival response perspective,. Intense, emotionally charged communication such as urgent text, emotional voicemails, or dramatic confrontations may be attempts to force reconnection, but often will result in further distancing.

So here's another, I should have said this up in the beginning. Another way that we can create drama as alienated parents is by taking every situation and making it a 9 1 1 emergency. Oh my God, they said this about me, they said that about me, blah. And you take it, you're, and it's, listen, I'm not making fun of that.

I don't mean to say it like that, but it's that like, dramatic, right? It feels dramatic for the parent that's experiencing this. So, I mean, I feel for you, because it's awful. It feels terrible when you're in it and it feels almost out of control.

Like from a, from a, . Cognitive place, right? Like, you really don't want to be there. Maybe you don't even notice you're there, so, but you tend to like, make the mountains outta molehill. But any sort of communication, negative or positive feels so uprooting to you and you feel like, ooh, right? You wanna jump outta your skin because you don't know what to do with the energy that's happening inside of you as a result of whatever contact or no contact that you get.

Instead, I'm gonna give you, um, solutions for that, like how to calm your nervous system here in a minute. So just hang on for a second. But back to where I was with the survival response perspective, just know, and you could say to yourself too, like any sort of urgent text your, your.

Viewing them as urgent or emotional voicemails or whatever, or any sort of confrontation. Just remind yourself too, that if this is you, it doesn't have to be 9 1 1, nothing. Unless there's somebody's life that's really like threatened. There's blood involved is what I used to tell my daughter.

Right? Unless somebody's bleeding or an ambulance needs to be called, let's not, let's lower , the intensity here, tell yourself some version of that too, right? It may be in your nervous system. You may think that those are ways that you can reconnect, but often will push them away,

okay. The parent from a survival response perspective, the parent may interpret any contact from their child or co-parent as an emergency, like I was just saying, responding with heightened anxiety or anger that turns even small events into dramatic episodes. It's just basically what I said, okay. If peacefully resolving a conflict feels threatening,  like it feels too vulnerable to, put yourself out there and approach them wanting to solve things

constructively, you know, drama can be subconsciously generated to restore a familiar sense of chaos and engagement. Like you may think that the only way that you can get the alienating parents' attention is by going back to your old ways of being defensive and confrontational. That feels like the only safe way to go about it, you know?

So just know too that this could be part of your survival response system that's taking over in that moment, even though you know that you want to employ a new way, like, take on a new approach to communicating with the alienating parent or with your kiddos, your survival system might take over without you even knowing and go back revert back to the old ways. Okay? So just know when that happens. Like if you, you make the quote unquote mistake and you do it. The way that you're always used to. It doesn't mean that you're doomed. It doesn't mean that anything's wrong with you. It doesn't mean that you're just wired for drama, trauma, whatever you wanna say for the rest of your life.

It's not true. Okay? It's just that those ways are more familiar for you right now, and they feel the safest. And you just have to recognize that in order to move through it and begin the new way. Okay? And it will take practice, and you will have, make the mistakes. You know what I'm saying? Until your body, your entire body becomes, and your nervous system becomes, you regulate your nervous system by doing the things I'm getting ready to tell you.

And you make that the new habit. You know? So it takes practice. A lot of practice. These patterns have been going on for you, likely since you were a kid, you know, little itty-bitty, who knows, you know, depending on , your childhood. But they've been going on for a while.

So it's just gonna take some patience and , some diligence, lots of diligence on your part in order to create new habits and new ways. Now the new ways will provide you a longstanding sense of peace and stability in your life, even though at first it's gonna feel not so safe because in your emotional brain, you're gonna have to put yourself on the line , and that's gonna feel vulnerable.

But just know in the end that you're actually creating so much more strength and resilience inside of you by employing the new ways.

Oh, I wanna say too, I forgot before I finish. Oh my gosh. Um, trauma recreation perspective, the repetition of old patterns I touched on already after cre, years of chronic stress that an alienated parent, uh, we might be wired to expect drama, feeling anxious where things are calm or misinterpreting neutral behaviors is hostile, , thereby, starting unnecessary disputes,

like I was kind of just talking about you're gonna go like revert to your old ways, but also your attempts to prove your loyalty to your kiddo. Or Yeah, or to your relationship, to your kiddo, you know, like as a whole, and also to your child's like true feelings. Like knowing what they really feel on the inside and knowing that they can't really hate you, that they really love you, but they can't show it.

That can lead to, like, your supposing of that out loud can lead to over interrogating overreporting or demanding displays of affection, which perpetuate drama more than, and rather than resolution. Okay? So just look at the, what you're assuming of your child, what you're telling yourself, the story that you're telling yourself

'cause those assumptions they're gonna lead you down a road that's gonna cause more drama, is what I'm saying.

Drama may briefly feel like it solves loneliness or hopelessness. However, it brings temporary relief followed by regret, shame, and deeper isolation, thus perpetuating the cycle. Okay, I'm gonna repeat this again. So I labeled it the tragic cycle drama may briefly feel like it solves loneliness or hopelessness.

However, it brings temporary relief, followed by regret, shame, and or deeper isolation, thus perpetuating the cycle.

Okay, you guys, I know I said I was gonna give you the solutions, in this episode, but I don't wanna make you guys listen to a super long episode. And also, I just got caught in the rain. You can't tell. So what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna continue this episode so that I can actually fully go into the solutions and the somatic exercises that I have, uh, outlined for you guys.

And I just, I'm gonna be able to better serve you splitting this up into two episodes, okay? So I'm gonna end it here, and I probably should tell you that in the front of this episode too. So, anyway, I'm gonna end it here. Just know that Luke, yours will be the next week after this.

And then next week I'm gonna finish this up with all the solutions, like all the ways that you can support yourself and bring yourself, , from drama creating.

Tendencies to like creating peace and liking it as opposed to always craving it, you know? Okay. So I will see you next week with all of those solutions and then Yes. S uh, performance anxiety will be the following week. Okay. Alright, now I think I should probably put that up in the front too.

Okay. Bye. You guys , have a lovely, lovely drama free week and I'll see you next week. Okay. Bye.

 Thanks so much for listening today. If you like what you're hearing and you'd like to hear more, please make sure to click subscribe wherever you're listening or watching. Also, for bite-sized clips and tips, be sure to find me on TikTok or Instagram. See you next week.